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Re: Carbon Dragon structural limits 10 Dec 2013 22:06 #520

My previous link does not seem to work. Here is another attempt if you are interested in the Alatus video's. Sorry.

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Karl

--- In This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it., "KarlS" wrote:
>
> Hi Steve,
> I am disappointed not to have decided to build the CD. What did you end up building if you do not mind me asking?
>
> With a super light tail assembly you would think the pilot almost has to be under the front part of the wing. Unless you forward sweep the wings.
>
> I owned an Alatus AL-12 for about 9 months. It had forward swept wings. I deeply regret selling the airplane. See

>
> One last thing here. I don't think this is the place to discuss other designs but I would like to say how much I like the Atos V series. To use that wing style in a different config is something I have pondered.
>
> Regards,
>
> Karl
>
> --- In This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it., Steve Adkins wrote:
> >
> > My club had a Schleicher Ka-7 ... the rear seat had the pilot's head in between the wing nose sections. Not the best.
> > www.eastcarolinasoaring.org/images/MaySoaring050309_1.jpg
> > www.eastcarolinasoaring.org/images/MaySoaring050309_2.jpg
> >
> > I too struggled with ways to improve visibility. Before deciding to build something else, I settled on making the Carbon Dragon seat more recumbent so that the head was below the wing. I built a plans accurate mockup of the pilot pod using scrap lumber. The recumbent position required extending nose 3-inches. This change moved the pilot's center of gravity forward making a nose-heavy glider even more nose heavy.
> >
> > As for visibility when circling in thermals. I shared a thermal at Harris Hill, NY with Gary Osoba. He was in the prototype Carbon Dragon built by Jim Maupin (and team) and I was in a Schweizer 2-33. I was in a medium bank turn attempting to "core" the thermal. Gary was circling with hardly any bank at all (Note: in a regular glider, Gary will bank almost vertical if needed to core the thermal); thus, Gary's circle was much larger than my circle. Gary easily out climbed me in the weaker lift ... left the thermal headed north towards Elmira and was circling in the next thermal by the time I reached the top of the thermal we had shared. I gave up trying to follow Gary.
> >
> > Phil's idea was interesting ... but does the wing strength depend on a nose skin extending all the way to the root of the wing? I have seen this type of solution to visibility in a few high wing powered craft but they all had wing struts which greatly reduces the need for strength at the wing root as compared to a cantilevered wing.
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > Hi Karl,
> >
> > You've hit the nail on the head re the visibility issue - that was my strong impression when I looked at photos of the CD too. However, after a quick look at the plans a simple solution presented itself - already discussed here groups.yahoo.com/group/Carbondragonbuild...ndpilots/message/287. In a nutshell, cut away the leading edge and angle the nose of the root rib out at 45-50 degrees towards the tip of the second rib and replace with a lexan nose-rib and thin lexan sheet for the leading edge in that section. It should improve the pilot's peripheral vision significantly.
> >
> > Phil.
> >
> > Karl and guys,
> > We discussed the visibility in another thread, but I couldn't see very well up and back, which is where you need to look while you are circling in thermals. My preference would be a mid-wing with my eyeline above the top of the wing and the ability to move my head to look back under the wing. I also want my eyeline forward of the leading edge at the root. Improved visibility would greatly improve the Carbon Dragon flying experience for me.
> >
> > ... snip ....
> >
> > After towing operations are developed, I plan on rolling into the design, build, test and operation of an ultralight sailplane. I won't talk too much about this on this group, since the subject is the Carbon Dragon, but the goal will be similar to the Carbon Dragon, only with the added stipulation that it will be designed to be built from plans and be adequate for folks up to 242 pounds (110 kg).
> >
> > The Archaeopteryx looks very nice, but has a similar configuration as the Carbon Dragon. It appears that the visibility is better than the CD, but not nearly as good as a conventional sailplane. The cost is also stratospheric.
> > ... snip ...
> >
> > Dan

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